Okay, the idiots in today’s right wing consider opposition to abortion to be the touchstone shibboleth of faith. The death of millions of innocent zygotes, whose lives they will defend, right up to the moment of birth and not one minute more is some kind of genocide. These same knuckleheads can’t find $100 a head to have at risk 5 year olds get a school lunch or tutoring, but God forbid that a cluster of 12 cells gets sucked into the Hoover and all hell breaks loose.
Jesus hung with ho’s and never said a thing about abortions. Think about it; unless these women only worked 3 days a month, they were practicing abortion, whether falling down stairs or using herbal potions. He never said a thing. What the hell is wrong with these idiots whose real motivation I believe is, “The little slut wouldn’t sleep with me. Screw her.” Or "I never got laid in high school, why should you?"
Oh the absurd suffering that's been laid (sic) on the world thru the sexual neurosis of the Religious Right and its' ancestors. A bunch of inhibited perverts, in my opinion. Latent child molesters and wanna be swingers with too much weird guilt to pull it off. Get over yourselves.
Justice and mercy anyone?
12 comments:
i want to place my comment on this post, because no one's done it yet, even though it should go a few posts down in the "serious christians contemplating the meaning of whatever" posts, not that there's anything wrong with that...
i, as did jeff and steve and, apparently, a gazillion other people, grew up in the south surrounded by people who deeply felt a religious urge, but had absolutely no intellectual knowledge of what positive thing might be done with all those feelings. not that i'm peddling intellectualism here - no way - i'm just grabbing onto that concept to try and articulate the fact that what the fundamentalists (most of whom couldn't spell the word) i grew up around lacked, was any sort of idea of god-jesus-whatever that had been explained to them by anyone other than another severely brain-deficient, inbred, jack-leg moron, who - by virtue of a diploma from some mail-order "seminary" or other - was communicating to them the basest, most simple-minded doctrine ever conceived by modern man.
one of the reasons i refer to christianity as a "gutter religion" has to do with the simplistic version of it that actually resides inside the heads, hearts and souls of most people who call themselves christians - god is a big, all-powerful white man who resides in the sky; jesus is the literal son of god, produced immaculately through mary; jesus died to redeem mankind (well, it didn't really take, did it?); in order to spend everlasting eternity in heaven on streets paved with gold, at the right hand of god, it doesn't matter what you've done for the entire sum total of your life, as long as you ask jesus to forgive you and accept him into your heart as your lord and saviour seconds before you die, then you'll live forever with the blessed even though you fucked your step-son in the ass right before you drove an ice pick through his skull...
you see what i mean about a "garbage religion?" do you want to spend eternity with josef goebbels, just in case he mumbled the magic words right before he poisoned the whole family?
okay, calm down, i'm not advocating buggery, murder or, well, i guess i am advocating poisoning nazis, but aside from that, i'm getting around to the well-reasoned, thoughtful, studious, pious reflections of people like aaron and steve and so many others that i know, who call themselves christians and actually go out into the world doing good things, but giving the credit to a jewish carpenter/rabbi who may or may not have existed (everything i've ever read leads me to believe the guy is a figment of many people's imaginations) 2000 years ago.
who cares to whom they give the credit, or from whom they derive their inspiration? it's generally only fundamentalists, of whatever stripe, who want to get in your face about where the other-worldly credit goes, and are willing to kill you over it.
most folks i know who are involved in doing things that might serve to shine the big flashlight on some deity or other, do so in low-key ways that probably are a credit to whatever idol they have in mind as they go about their daily round - god, yahweh, diana, beelzebub, thor, jesus, allah, jehovah, the venus of willendorf, vampira, jack kerouac - but, they aren't willing to cut your head off about your inability to accept the perfect intellectual certainty and proof that the ideas in their heads are TRUE, ABSOLUTELY AND WITHOUT A DOUBT, TRUE! for christ's sake...
here's what i know, after damned near fifty years on the planet earth, and any of this can be disputed by "religion" or by specific cases of various saints and holy men who may or may not have lived among us, but here it is -
people have very few needs that absolutely have to be met for their survival.
1. clothing and shelter can be folded into one, because if you have enough bearskins you can live outside in the coldest climate, and, in the tropics you can live under a fruit tree without a thing on.
2. need number two is food and water, and i'm not putting these things in order, obviously, because if you die from starvation or thirst, there's not a pair of calvin kleins in the universe that'll do you any good, so get that whole numerical ordering thing out of your heads right now (we're talking metaphysics, right, so don't get hung up, baby).
3. the only other absolutely biological imperative is the need, the urge, the fucking itch, to reproduce, as evidenced by the amorous proclivities of every living organism from flagellates to firemen. we must spread the seed, we must do the deed and, as every guy knows, we'll tell the most egregious lies to try and make that happen EVEN AFTER WE'VE BEEN VASECTOMIZED AND DOMESTICATED, as much as we can be.
but then, we start to evolve - we notice that the sun rises and sets every day, that it gets dark earlier in the winter, maybe women have something to do with the fact that these screaming new people pop out of their vaginas every so often - and pretty soon, before you know it, a la the elephant man, we're screaming, " i am not an animal, i'm a human being!" now, never mind that what we are, to this day, is about 98% wild animal (99.9% in the case of most neo-conservatives), with just enough cerebral cortex to develop the required mathematical and chemical formulae to fuck up the entire planet FOREVER, but, no, we're then going to develop an entire class of human being whose whole way of making it through this limited existence is, "hey, i know it makes no sense, but there are people, no, well, beings, i mean, they weren't really people, but they lived here, i mean, a long time ago, and, well, they said some things that were actually, no, literally, truer than anything that anyone ever said before or since, and, well, i have some pieces of paper that, well, we don't know who actualy wrote them, but i believe, i mean, there are a bunch of us who believe, that they were written by some people who may have heard stories from the people who might have had some inside information on some, well, i mean, it's pretty confusing and i can see that you're a little dubious, but, okay, i have it on good authority that if you don't pay attention to this stuff YOU AND EVERYONE RELATED TO YOU WILL BURN IN A FIERY PIT AFTER YOU DIE!"
let's use a bit more of our brains, here, people, shall we?
1. if there is a (spark) (intelligence) (omniscient being) (cosmic mother) (precipitating physical event) (fill in the blank) then it got the whole ball rolling, but it is the same thing no matter what you call it. in other words, if there is a god, it is the same god for all of us.
2. if that is true, then it/he/she/they is indifferent to your ideas about what it/he/she/they may be, because IF it/he/she/they can get the ball rolling, why should it/he/she/they give a rat's ass what you think? it's a cosmic juggernaut, baby, and cosmic juggernauts are not known for their concern for your delicate sensibilities!
3. the way we know that this force (call it what you will) is indifferent to our need to claim it as our own is evident in the variety of religious barriers (for want of a better word) we have thrown up in the way of not only understanding this force, but in the faces of our fellow human beings, who we all believe to be animated by this very same force! if there is only one god, and it/he/she/they are responsible for our well-being here and for all eternity, there are only two conclusions we can come to: god is an evil force determined to see every human being kill every other human being because of petty, sectarian, nationalistic strife; or; god is totally indifferent to the fact that we as animals haven't evolved sufficiently to be able to control our baser instincts faster than our cerebral cortices have enabled us to invent the hydrogen bomb!
there you have it , friends, my theology, cosmogony, social philosophy and gastro-enterology, all in one place...
Rick Prose is my lord and saviour.
funny, i just had a discussion with your mother about this today.
(i really did but as i wrote this i realize it's sorta like those bumper stickers that say "are you glad your mother didn't abort you?")
Abortion, yes, what a weird thing
First i doubt Jesus thought it was a great idea, Mother Teresa has a great quote about abortion where she really gets at the heart of how abortion is a severe form of people dodging responsibilities,
Anyway i have two things to say about abortion
1. It is sick how the Right uses one issue to get alot of people to vote for them. Mainly un-politically savvy christians (like my grandmoms) who only know they hate abortion so they vote for the guy against it, who also happens to be against a lot of good things, like you mentioned
2. Having said that I do not agree with abortion. There is birth control and plenty of places to get it. There are many people who cannot have children who would love to adopt an unwanted child.
Bill Clinton said it best, "Abortion should be cheap, legal and rare."
The problem is that the exact same knuckleheads who oppose abortion OPPOSE BIRTH CONTROL!!!
Abstinence Only education is a fairy tale that doesn't work. The sexual urge in humans is up there with thirst and hunger, so to have an entire religious movement be based on ignoring it is stupid, cruel and futile.
Actually he said, "Safe, legal and rare."
When folks say, 'I don't believe in abortion' I'm perplexed. I don't believe people should get obese and have corrective abdominal surgery, as did Al Roker. I don't believe women should get raped by their uncles. I don't believe some people should succumb to natural biological urges and put themselves at risk for STD's or unwanted fetuses. I don't believe in a lot of things that happen everyday. But they still happen. No one 'believes' in abortion. Like, let's all go out and celebrate the wonderful thing that is ABORTION!! Yeh!!! Hip hip hurray for ABORTIONS! It is a procedure that is not subject to being believed in, or value judgments, in my opinion. It is a very necessary medical procedure in a very personal, sensitive, and problematic situation for an individual woman. If someone 'doesn't believe in abortion', they shouldn't have one and they should put themselves on the 'do not call' list when all the 'abortion believers' go to their sacred church of abortion to celebrate and worship aborted fetuses, and to make their phone solicitations seeking volunteers for more fun and exciting abortions.
O.K...I admit it. I am more then perplexed when I hear comments like, 'I don't believe in abortion.' Don't believe in Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy, but abortions exist, always have and probably always will. Looks like the current trend in abstinence only and putting human sexuality back in the legislative hands bound by moral/religious judgment (as opposed to learning the science, being open, honest and real about human sexual urges and behaviors) will, unfortunately, only add to the long list of 'abortion believers'.
Of course I believe in abortion.
I've seen it don once.
Yeah, Rick Prose rocks!
Hi Rick Prose!
...as Paula noted...societies have been practicing abortion since the beginning of time...whether it be in the middle of the jungle, or the middle of the city...and it will go on forever because it is a NATURAL part of being human (whether people think it is wrong or not)
- so we might as well, as Clinton put it, make it safe and legal (and I personally don't care how rare, and - cheap would be good too)
- Jeff makes an excellent point, so much attention to this matter of caring for cells, when children die everyday of neglect, abuse etc. WTF
The wonderful Roy Blount famously tells a joke that separates the religious from the not. The religious find this funny:
Person 1: "Do you believe in infant baptism?"
Person 2: "Believe in it? I've seen it done!"
well, we used to tell that joke in alabama, but it was about "full immersion baptism," and we tended to tell it using al jolson-like negro voices, but enough about my problems...
yeah, i did get off the abortion topic, but when i see a blank wall, i tend to start spraying and think about it later. paula's comments are right in line with my own (one of the reasons i don't say things like "i don't believe in religion," is because it actually exists and, thus, has to be dealt with in a more-or-less rational way). i have known women very close to me, who for one reason or another, chose to abort a fetus rather than make the mistake of trying to raise a child, under circumstances that were less than ideal.
three of those fetuses had chromosomes that came directly from me, and i bear as much responsibility for whatever decision may have been made as the potential mothers do. though both parties might be accused of being careless, all of those women were thoughtful, intelligent, loving people who melt at the sight of babies and bear feelings of regret, to a greater or lesser extent, to this day. and those women are people you could consider advantaged in terms of socio-economic and educational status, compared to the mass of women who simply can't conceive of the idea of raising a, or another, child.
yes, abortion has been with us always (which gets back to my 98% animal argument, in a way), but so has the concept that our bodies belong to us, not to the government. racial hatred, murder, theft, war, cheating, those have also been with us always. maybe, if we focused more of our attention on ridding the world (by "the world" of course, i mean "us") of those animalistic impulses that give rise to so much suffering, we might, someday, create a world in which safe, effective birth control is as available as crack in the lower ninth ward, and where the idea of parents who just can't take care of a child leaves people scratching their heads.
as always, arguing for reason, compassion and hope,
rick
I think the real question that comes from your point Jeff is whether or not it's possible to be against abortion without an affiliation or comparison to the Religious Right's(RR) way of opposition.
In other words, can I have integrity and honesty in believing something to be wrong without being a menacing judge at the same time?
The answer has to be yes. Jesus shows us how to do this.For the RR it's clearly a matter of status politics right? Abortion/gay marriage/home schooling, even the welfare state, and so on, all these are issues swirling around the sanctity of the nuclear family as a political base not as solid moral ground.
So...I know thats all simplistic but again I think the point (and this is your point I think) has to be that one can believe abortion is wrong and yet still...miraculously! know that person without making hateful status distinctions.
Josh, the issue isn't who can oppose what. I think Rick put it really well that our system of governance requires tolerance of an amazing range of really crazy ideas, so of course you can have any opinion you want. But I very firmly believe deep in my heart that anti-abortion activists are very often motivated by a deep and ancient sexism.
As has been said, and I also believe, if men could get pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament.
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